[ People cheering ]
-After months of campaigning
and tens of millions of dollars spent on attack ads...
-Who's to blame? Patty Murray.
-...the midterm elections are finally over.
-Tiffany Smiley -- the wrong choice for Washington.
-From the balance of power in Congress to a battle
to lead the Washington Secretary of State's office,
much was at stake on November 8th.
-Democracy is too important to disenfranchise people.
-I'm definitely an underdog.
-Seattle voters also picked the next King County prosecutor
and voiced on whether to change future city elections.
What political strategies worked and what didn't in 2022?
-Republican Party really paid a price
for their sort of wacky candidates.
-Our veteran journalists weigh in.
-Democrats have overreached when it comes to reform --
criminal legal system reforms.
-Recapping the results of the midterm elections --
next on "City Inside Out."
♪♪
Welcome to this edition of "City Inside Out."
I'm your host, Brian Callanan.
Amidst a flood of national news about the midterm elections,
voters in our state have some high-stakes local races
they're watching closely, too.
From a fight over political identity
in the Secretary of State's race
to several political newcomers running for state legislature,
we'll have a full slate of new leaders in Olympia.
Plus, there's a new King County prosecutor
for the first time in 15 years,
a county-wide land-conservation tax levy,
and a Seattle measure that may change the future
of our citywide elections.
This week, we're reviewing the early election results
on the races that affect you the most.
-Tiffany Smiley -- the wrong choice for Washington.
Who's to blame? Patty Murray.
-In a bruising race for U.S. Senate,
the most expensive in Washington state history,
incumbent Democrat Patty Murray and her opponent,
Tiffany Smiley, both painted each other as party extremists.
The race was called for Murray after election night returns.
But Smiley said it was too early to concede.
-Good evening, everyone.
-It was a similar partisan fight
in our state's eighth congressional district.
-We don't need another two years of the same direction.
-He aligns with some of the most extreme members of Congress.
-Incumbent Democrat Kim Schrier is leading Republican
challenger Matt Larkin, 53% to 47% in early returns.
-I've worked in a bipartisan manner.
I've worked across the aisle.
-Politics is a polarizing distraction
for the Secretary of State.
-In the Washington Secretary of State race,
Democrat Steve Hobbs,
appointed last year, leads his nonpartisan opponent,
Julie Anderson, in his quest for two more years on the job.
But it's a tight 50% to 47% margin
after election night.
In the state legislature,
it's a changing of the guard for many Seattle-area seats
with first-time candidates,
all Democrats, facing off against each other in the House.
In the 34th,
Emily Alvarado is leading Leah Griffin, 69% to 30%.
In the 37th,
Chipalo Street is beating Emijah Smith, 54% to 44%.
And in the 46th, Darya Farivar is winning 56% to 43%
over Dr. Lelach Rave.
Democrats control the state Senate, 28 seats to 21,
and the state House, 57 to 41.
And early results show they'll add seats to those majorities,
as they've been able to do since 2016.
For King County prosecutor,
voters are selecting Lisa Mannion,
the incumbent's current Chief of Staff,
over Federal Way Mayor Jim Ferrell --
55% to 44%, according to election-night numbers.
-It's important that every vote get counted.
-Mannion says her platform of prosecuting violent crime
and using restorative justice programs
resonated with county voters.
-It is my deep level of experience.
It's the balanced approach.
-King County's Proposition 1,
the Conservation Futures Tax, or CFT levy,
is passing by a wide 68% to 32% margin in early returns.
-I'm all for open space, but enough is enough.
-Despite concerns from some taxpayers,
the CFT faced no organized opposition,
and the average property owner will now pay about
$30 more per year for land preservation in King County.
-It's a matter of sort of pay a little bit now
or pay a lot more later.
-Seattle's Proposition 1 posed a fundamental question --
is it time to change the way we vote?
-The thing about Prop 1A is it delivers
the most representative voting system we can have.
-Early results show a "no" vote, 51% to 49%,
to Prop 1's main question,
asking if our voting system should be changed.
But if the measure does pass,
voters chose option 1B over 1A on election night,
meaning future citywide elections
would use a ranked choice system
rather than an approval voting system as early as 2027.
-I'm really excited that we can have better elections
in a really simple and effective way.
-From preserving the status quo in our state's
congressional delegation
to a changing of the guard in Olympia to setting the tone
for prosecuting crime in King County,
it's time to assess some major themes from the 2022 midterms
after a hard-fought battle to Election Day.
And we're joined by an esteemed group of journalists
to break down some of these issues.
I will start with Naomi Ishisaka.
She is a columnist for "The Seattle Times,"
the Assistant Managing Editor for Diversity,
Inclusion, and Staff Development.
Naomi, great to have you here.
-Great to be here. Thank you.
-And we also have Will Casey -- he's the law and justice
reporter for "The Stranger."
Will, good to have you, too.
-Thanks for having me. -All righty.
Let's jump right into it, and to start with,
we're looking at some very, very early numbers here.
So just want to make sure that we're clear on that.
But I think it is safe to say that the red wave
a lot of people were talking about
didn't really materialize here in the midterms.
Certainly not nationwide and definitely not
in Washington state.
So, Naomi, I want to start with this race for U.S. Senate,
between the incumbent Democrat, Patty Murray,
Republican challenger Tiffany Smiley.
Murray won it. Race was called an election night.
Though Smiley was telling her supporters, "It ain't over."
Were you surprised by this result?
-You know, I was a little surprised.
And first, I just want to say the biggest winner
of all of this is, of course,
the viewers who don't have to watch these incessant ads...
-Well played. Yes.
-...that have been going for seemingly nonstop 24/7
for the past few months. -Yeah.
-But, yeah, I was surprised, I think, you know,
because I've seen the incessant ads
and because, you know, things did not seem like
they were gonna be as as close as they were.
I do think that some of the conventional wisdom
was a little bit overblown, that some of the vulnerabilities
that they thought were gonna be,
you know, weighing down on on Murray
didn't really materialize in the way that they expected.
-Yeah, could be one of the longest-serving
senators we've ever had coming up here.
Will, some thoughts on this race,
also the most expensive U.S. Senate race
in our state history here.
Smiley was even out-gaining Murray in fund-raising
down the stretch here, but it wasn't enough.
Some reactions to this result here.
-Well, I think it's just an indication of how tough
it's going to be for Republicans to win statewide at all,
unless they significantly sort of re-brand
and try to tack back to the middle.
And they've just, as J.T. Wilcox will tell you,
you know, had a hard time enforcing
sort of party discipline up and down the ballot.
So I think, you know,
so long as they're getting clobbered in King County
where there's a large portion of the state population --
-A lot of voters here. Yeah.
-And frankly, voters who show up, right?
And I think that's gonna be a challenge
for them going forward.
-Okay. And it seemed like a similar story playing out
in the eighth Congressional District.
It hasn't been called yet,
but Democrat Kim Schrier up six points on Matt Larkin
according to the election night numbers.
Will, maybe I'll start with you here.
National elections experts were calling this
a toss-up kind of a district.
Any surprises on this one, specifically?
-I don't think so, mostly because Schrier
has done a really good job of highlighting her
independent record of delivering for the district, right?
You've seen a lot of her advertising was focused on,
you know, specific accomplishments
she's done to help build infrastructure over the
east side of the mountains and really sort of touting her,
you know, sort of bipartisan bona fides.
-She had some bills that Trump supported and Biden supported.
I remember that part, too. -Right. Exactly.
And so I think that sort of, you know,
sort of "willing to buck the party label" thing helps
with those more centrist voters in central Washington.
And then, you know, Eastern King County
these days, just deep blue.
-Yeah. Yeah. It's an interesting district there for sure.
Naomi, some thoughts about this.
I know "The Times" and "The Stranger"
both endorsed Kim Schrier and Patty Murray,
for that matter, and that dual endorsement
doesn't always happen between the two papers,
but it was a full moon last night,
so I'll just chalk it up to that.
Why do you think Republicans could not flip this district?
Any thoughts there?
-Well, and I think, you know, I think my colleague
Danny Westneat talked about this a little bit in his column.
You know, I think there was a little bit of a, perhaps,
lack of respect for the need to have winnable arguments
that reach the middle. -Yes.
I think one of the things that Kim Schrier did,
like Will's saying, is she really expressed
how she was serving all the people in her district,
whereas I think Matt Larkin ran on more of a, you know,
die-hard right approach that didn't really translate
well, I think, to the moderate voters.
-He had just kind of doubled down on that.
And I was thinking, too, about the third
Congressional District, too, down around Vancouver there.
Will, any thoughts on this one?
Joe Kent, I know, is a big-time
Trump-backed candidate, etcetera.
It looks like, for the first time in a while,
Clark County is gonna flip blue.
That a big deal down there. -That is a big deal.
And I mean, you know, cards on the table.
I worked for the first challenger, you know,
to Jamie Herrera Buetler back in 2018, Carolyn Long,
and so, you know, it's been a multi-year, you know,
organizing effort down there, and I think that they're really
starting to see some of the fruits of the labor
of running competitive candidates cycle after cycle.
You know, you build on that success.
And Marie didn't need to, you know, start from scratch,
which I think is really important
when you're trying to flip that kind of a reach district.
-She seemed like a relative unknown down there.
Your thoughts about that?
A lot of money got poured into that district, too.
-Yeah, I mean, I think she had a profile,
even though she was a first-time candidate,
that really sort of resonated with the district, right?
Small-business owner, you know, built her own home.
I think those kind of, like, apolitical
but, like, relatable
sort of characteristics really served her well.
And also, she was very compromising about
reaching across to Jaime Herrera Buetler supporters,
who might have felt disappointed by the primary.
-Right. Right. Important piece there.
I'm gonna try to put this in perspective,
if I can, on a national level.
And Naomi, I'll start with you here.
Republicans could still take the House by a slim majority there.
Republicans also had some big wins.
I'm thinking about Governor Ron DeSantis in Florida,
even flipped a few traditionally Democrat
districts there to get that victory.
So without a clear election-night victory,
let's say, for either party here,
how do we come out of this election as a country?
Are we less divided than when we entered into it?
Do you have any thoughts about that?
Because it just -- it seems a little undecided.
I saw "undecided" on so many different headlines
today after Election Day.
And I just wanted to get your thoughts on that.
-Yeah, I was struck by some of the exit polling yesterday
that showed that there was actually a lot of discontent
around Democratic policies.
There was discontent with Biden.
And yet people still, you know, supported the Democrats
in all different kinds of races, and I think what that tells us
is that they might have their concerns
and they might have their reservations,
but at the end of the day, they're worried about
abortion rights, they're worried about --
-I was gonna say those issues. -Yeah.
They're worried about things
that affect them on the day-to-day, whether or not --
you know, less on sort of the very, very shrill attacks
that we've seen mostly on these, you know, ad campaigns.
But they're also -- just want to see
that they have bodily autonomy, have health care,
have the things that matter in their day-to-day life.
And to me, that's the uniting factor
that you're seeing across the board.
-Got it. Will, maybe I can go to you on this one.
It was a great line in "The New York Times,"
more of a red ripple than a red wave on election night there.
But looking at that national picture, are we less divided?
Are there some themes that you can associate with voters
here after Election Day?
-Well, I think you saw the president
try to make a closing argument,
you know, the week leading into Election Day
that, you know, just enough of us on
just enough occasions have, you know, come together
to decide that we want to continue to be a democracy.
And I think that's basically what you saw, you know?
There's still a very loud
not as small of a minority as we'd like it to be,
probably, who don't seem to be that concerned with, you know,
continuity of of democratic institutions in this country.
But enough of the folks did show up.
And I think that that's really what you saw, you know,
across the various swing districts,
although gerrymandering means we have far fewer
competitive House races than we did even two years ago.
-Right. Right. And is it a situation --
Naomi was bringing up issues like reproductive rights.
Was there an issue that you think really brought voters out?
I know a lot of people are concerned about the economy,
inflation at a 40-year high here.
Anything like that that drew people out in your mind?
-I think more than any of those individual issues,
what you saw was people being truly unsettled
by how far out of the mainstream,
like, most of the Republican candidates have gone.
And I think that you saw that in, for example,
Pennsylvania's Senate race, right?
I think if Dr. Oz wasn't a, you know, fraudster on TV
and it was instead just sort of a normal, you know,
maybe a state legislator seeking a promotion
or something, that might have been a more competitive race.
But I think the Republican Party really paid a price
for their sort of wacky candidates
that they recruited this cycle.
-We will see what happens in Georgia, though.
Yeah. Keep going.
-I think there's also something
that happened in terms of I think
Republicans really tried to press this idea
that Democrats were soft on crime
and that, you know, the cities were kind of on fire
and it was an apocalyptic hellscape.
And that didn't seem to gain a lot of traction with voters.
And I think that, you know, that barrage of advertising,
it didn't really show up in the polls in the way
that I think they thought it would.
And I think that cost them.
-Yeah. And I want to talk about this partisan idea here.
Back to some local races here,
a very interesting partisan versus nonpartisan battle
for the Secretary of State race in our state.
Steve Hobbs appointed to the job last year. He's a democrat.
Julie Anderson, Pierce County Auditor,
ran as a nonpartisan -- a close one on election night.
Hobbs leading %50 to 47%.
But Will, you wrote about this race a couple of weeks ago,
and I thought this was fascinating.
Polls then, at the time, were showing that Republican voters
might write in State Representative Brad Klippert
from the eighth district down in Kennewick.
So the GOP didn't win this race necessarily,
but the fact that 3.1% of the voters,
at least on election night,
supported a write-in candidate, they might have given this
to the to the Democrats, it looks like.
-Yeah, and I think that that's interesting
because when I was writing that piece,
we were drawing on the sort of example
of a 2020 lieutenant governor's race, right?
And that's where you had Joshua Freed
running as a write in candidate,
and he really mounted a full-scale campaign.
I think what you didn't see as much this cycle was Klippert
didn't seem to have as much infrastructure,
and whether or not the state Republican Party
decided to do a big organizing push for him.
Maybe it was too late of a decision. Who knows?
But as you said,
it does seem like he might have pulled the race
just enough away from Anderson to give Hobbs the victory.
-That's gonna be so interesting to see how that plays out.
I know there's still a ways
to go in terms of counting votes.
Naomi, back to you on this one.
The "Times" editorial board endorsed Steve Hobbs
but has also supported this proposal from Julie Anderson
to remove the party label from electing a Secretary of State,
which I thought was very interesting.
What's your takeaway from this partisan-nonpartisan race
for Secretary of State?
That was a big issue in this.
-Yeah, I don't know too much about that part of it,
but I do think that people are at a, you know,
obviously a huge amount of sensitivity
around election security
and partisanship and electioneering,
and I think if there's ways to bring
more trust into the process, I think that's a good thing.
-Yeah. Yeah.
First person of color to be elected
to this position, too, in Steve Hobbs.
I think that might have some resonance, too.
It was certainly something that he campaigned on
in terms of reaching out to people, etcetera.
Did you have any any feel for that,
how that impacted his campaign?
-I don't know. Not too much.
I mostly know him from before this race.
And, you know, he's a little bit more conservative --
on the conservative side, so I didn't see that playing --
-A radical moderate, I think he called himself.
-Yeah, I didn't see that playing out
as much with the people I know
in terms of thinking about it in that way.
But maybe it did persuade some people.
-Interesting pieces in all these races here.
So, Will, I'm gonna go back to you
and talk about our state legislature.
So, if the results from election night hold true,
Dems could pick up a seat in the Senate
and three additional House seats.
They already have a majority in both.
So no red wave -- definitely sticking with that theme.
But I'm wondering what the bigger takeaway
is on the state level.
Will we see a push now in Olympia
next session for Democrats
looking for a state constitutional amendment
for abortion rights or stronger gun laws,
or any thoughts about what stronger Democratic majorities
in the state House and Senate could mean?
Well, I think they fell just a couple of seats short
of being able to reach the majorities
they would need to amend the Constitution
for abortion rights, because, you know, at this point,
our reporting shows, like, not a single Republican
is willing to go across party lines and support that.
However, I think you are gonna see sort of an argument
that centrists within the party in Olympia
have been using for the last couple of sessions
really kind of lose a lot of traction,
which is basically they need to be careful
about how aggressive they push on things
like affordable housing or progressive taxation,
because, you know,
the suburban voters might have a backlash if they go too far.
But I think what we've seen, you know,
three cycles in a row now is that the Republican Party
just isn't competitive in a significant way.
And really, the only check on whether or not voters
are gonna be happy with the Democrats
are gonna come from within the party itself.
-Yeah, they've been building on those majorities since 2016,
and it's important to point that out.
Naomi, I wanted to make sure I looked here in the Seattle area,
specifically -- a lot of new faces,
political newcomers, actually, to the 34th,
37th, and 46th districts.
Any expectations there,
from what we would see from that Seattle delegation
when it comes to what's next in Olympia?
-Yeah, I mean, I'm excited to see
what's next on that front.
I think, you know, both in 37th, where I'm from, and the 34th,
if I'm remembering the districts right.
That's the one with Darya...
-She's 46. -46. Yep.
That one, I think, is really interesting, too,
because she brings the diversity rights perspective to it.
And I think that's such an important aspect
to bring into the legislature, to have that sort of thinking
about how do our policies
and our politics affect people with disabilities.
I think that's something that we don't talk about enough.
And I think if we can have a wider conversation about that,
that's a beautiful thing.
And then in the 37th, I think, you know,
we've always had a very strong progressive
for, you know, as long as I can remember.
-Many years. Yeah. -Yeah.
People of color in leadership.
-Pramila Jayapal not too many years ago.
-Yeah. Sharon Tomiko Santos.
I think there's a long history of that in the south end,
and I think that a lot of the progressive legislation
that happens really gets pushed from the south end of Seattle.
And so I think we're gonna see that continuing.
-That is gonna be interesting,
especially when it comes to police accountability,
which I know has taken a bit of a roller-coaster ride
over the past couple of years in Olympia.
So I'll be very closely
looking at what those legislators do.
But I want to jump down to the King County level
and the vote for prosecutor here -- very interesting here.
Dan Satterberg stepping down after 15 years on the job.
His Chief of Staff, Lisa Mannion, held a 55% to 44%
lead over Federal Way Mayor Jim Ferrell on election night.
Naomi, I'll start with you here. "Times" endorsed Farrell,
but he also had the endorsement of several police unions.
It looks like he's getting pushed back here.
What do you make of this result?
I thought it was very surprising.
-Yeah. I mean, I think this
goes back to what I was saying earlier.
I think that this idea that Democrats have overreached
when it comes to reform -- criminal legal system reforms.
I think we're seeing sort of a, you know,
kind of a backlash to that narrative, right?
I think we're seeing that people
aren't as unwilling to try new approaches.
I think we're seeing in this Mannion race
that some of the things that she's advocating for,
such as, you know, looking at how do we make public safety --
think about public safety more broadly
rather than, you know, jails and cops.
But how do we create all the conditions
so that we don't have crime in the first place?
I think we're seeing a lot more receptivity to that approach
than we might have thought before this election.
-Yeah. All right, Mr. Law and Justice Reporter,
let's talk to you about this.
It really did seem like Jim Ferrell
was trying to out-law and -justice Lisa Mannion here,
saying he'd be tougher on crime, etcetera.
And I'm really thinking about how Seattle voters
have said yes to that message
a little bit over the last couple of years here.
Haven't supported candidates seen as more progressive.
I'm kind of thinking of this broadly here.
With all that in mind,
were you surprised at this election result?
-No, simply because we're in an even-year electorate, right?
I think that, like, what you see, I mean,
just looking at the traffic on our endorsements page,
for example, compared to last year,
it's not just --
I mean, it was several orders of magnitude larger
than we saw in the 2021 race.
And I think that's just because you have more younger people,
you have people who move more frequently
that don't necessarily tune into politics
as a sort of hobby of theirs.
But when you have the national sort of media being like,
"Hey, everyone pay attention, it's time to vote,"
then they realize that it's time to tune in.
And so I think it's really a difference
of just what kind of participation you're getting.
And then, also, I think that this race, frankly,
was really encouraging to me
in how the electorate was processing
the two candidates, right?
Because I think Ferrell had a more traditional --
you know, he's a middle-aged white guy.
He's very personable.
He's been practicing how to, you know, appeal to an audience,
do well in interviews like this.
Whereas Mannion, as a first-time candidate,
you know, was a little bit stiffer,
didn't have as much of a, you know,
skill in terms of presentation, but is clearly, like, qualified.
You talk to her for any period of time
and you understand that she has a much better grasp
on the details of policy and frankly,
just the inner workings of the office that she's been in,
which makes sense because she's been doing it for 20-some years.
And so I think that voters rewarding that issue areas,
you know, expertise and experience
over sort of the sizzle
of a practiced politician is really encouraging.
-Well, let's talk about what voters might not be doing,
and that's change the way they vote.
I'm going to shift to Proposition 1,
and Will, I'll start with you here.
I thought it was interesting "The Stranger" endorsed
a "no" vote on the first question of this measure.
Should we change our voting system?
And voters election night
narrowly actually agreed with that, 51% to 49%.
They also agreed that between the choices of approval voting
versus ranked choice voting,
ranked choice would be the better idea.
So if that "no" holds for question one,
but then voters also support option 1B
for ranked choice voting, I'm confused already,
but where does that lead us?
What do you think? -Sure. Sure, sure, sure.
I'll explain because this was a debate we had
in our newsroom for weeks,
because it's frankly just a very complicated question.
And it really just boiled down to the fact
that in most localities that implement ranked choice voting,
the main benefit you get
is that you combine the primary and the general election.
So voters only have to vote in one election, which is helpful,
and it gives candidates a longer runway
to make their arguments to voters
and, frankly, get more attention,
aside from the super plugged-in primary voters who show up
and are following this from day one of the campaigns.
And so I think our decision was largely based on the fact
that because of state law,
we don't have the ability to do that in this implementation.
But we still wanted to have a strong signal to policymakers
at the county level and in Olympia
that people do want ranked choice voting.
We would just like the flexibility
of getting all the benefits. -Got it. Got it.
I know the state's working on some issues there.
King County is working on this one, too.
Naomi, some thoughts on this one?
This proposition was definitely challenging to understand.
"The Times" also endorsed a "no" vote on question one
and said "pick neither one" on 1A and 1B.
And I should point out that ranked choice
got demolished in other jurisdictions.
They were thinking about this in our state.
Clark County in San Juan County said no
with strong majorities there.
What do you think happens next with this idea
of changing the way we vote, potentially?
-Yeah, I mean, it's unfortunate because I was super confused
just reading the ballot language.
You know, and I work at a newspaper.
I'm a native English speaker, and I couldn't make heads
or tails out of it.
And thankfully, you know,
reading these different resources,
was able to kind of make some sense
of what some of the core issues are.
But I think looking at how we vote is really important.
And I think that this is, you know,
in a lot of ways, a positive step forward as an approach,
but not if people don't understand how it works.
And you're creating all this confusion
and chaos in some ways.
I think, you know, if this is something
that we want to explore, look at,
it has to be done in a much more streamlined,
clear, you know, way that the voters can understand.
-Yeah, just about the only place where approval voting
and ranked choice voting were on the ballot,
which I think made it very difficult for people.
It is time to wrap up.
And Naomi, let me start with you here.
Some thoughts about turnout for this election.
I called King County elections to talk about this.
They're telling me it'll wind up close to 65%,
which is lower than the 72%
they thought we might have at least a couple of weeks ago
and definitely lower than the 76% turnout we had in 2018.
Anything you make of that? Were people turned off?
Not as many people wanted to show up? Any thoughts there?
-Yeah, it's really surprising to hear that
because, you know, looking at what happened
yesterday at Lumen Field, you know, people lining up...
-Lot of people. Yeah. -...for hours to try
to vote provisionally or vote for the first time.
You saw full ballot boxes.
I mean, obviously that's not quantitative information.
But I do think it's telling.
I'm surprised that that's the outcome.
But one of the things that I think is important
as a takeaway, perhaps, from this election
is the vote of young people, of Gen-Z.
I think we're gonna see a lot of stories about that.
And you're seeing an overwhelming favor
towards Democrats from that generation,
and you're seeing the first Gen-Z person
elected to Congress.
So I think that's gonna be a story we're gonna be
talking about for a long time and might be the sleeping giant
that people haven't really been paying enough attention to.
-Interesting points there, all. Thank you.
Will, any thoughts about voter turnout? Just wrapping up here.
-Oh, I just think it's gonna be interesting to see,
once we can really dive into the details of that data,
where the drop-off happened, right?
Because I think something I've been curious about
for the last couple of election cycles here
is as sort of a shibboleth among the Republican Party
nationally becomes, you know,
that they don't trust our election systems,
that's gonna have some sort of trickle-down effect
and discouraging turnout, and I think that that's,
you know, frankly, a very concerning trend,
because if people start --
if there are no wins, right, for those candidates,
then it's sort of a self-feeding narrative
and you get an increasingly larger and larger portion
of the electorate that just doesn't have
a relationship to the system, and that's a problem.
-Okay. Well, we're gonna talk about these problems, I know,
over the next several months and years.
So I appreciate all this back and forth.
Will and Naomi, thank you very much.
And we will be right back.
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♪♪